58:32 to 2:07:04
Question: Charles Ledger cold staking will be integrated a launch of Shelly?
Answer: yeah we're gonna get all the firmware update there so that'll be cold staking and hopefully multi-sig with the ledger as well we're working with vacuum labs for that now I'm gonna start getting a bit more involved on the product side there come June and actually the other thing we're really looking into is how do we read the phyto u2f a standard so that we can get a much better and more secure user experience for Daedalus so one of the things I'm very keen to do you have these things called UB keys that's a final you to FA device I don't have one on me right now maybe I have one right here I haven't a safe so I'll have to grab it later but alright we have these things called UB keys and if you go to you if just googled Yubikey y ubi ke y UB keys are little devices and they have tons of crypto capabilities they're like the Swiss Army knife of crypto and they're really good for three things one they're good for access control so basically when you want to get into a threshold enter a website you can use a password but a lot of cases two-factor authentication you would use a UB key as well like for Google you can do this and many other websites like LastPass you can do this and basically in addition the password you have to have the physical device plug it in push a button and then it gives you access to that site so access control second it can store a cryptographic assets like passwords so one of the things we could do is say all right for Daedalus instead of having spending password you use your UV key as the spending password so when you go to send a transaction you have to plug the device in and push a button to send the transaction so you never have to remember a password you just use a physical device and then three we're looking into the u2 fa photo stuff or account recovery so be really nice if you had the wallet recovery phrase on the Yubikey or some device like that you plug it into the and you recover from that with a pin code yeah seven digit a six digit PIN code or something like that as opposed to try and remember 12 keywords and what's nice about this is that there's all kinds of stuff you can do with ping codes where you can securely erase if they entered it like wrong 20 times or make it really hard to enter it more than a few times incorrectly and being able to cover from Yubikey you have a great wallet recovery experience from a cold boot you can just plug the key in click a button enter the pin code then boom the wallet is restored so we're kind of exploring that standard and you know what we might do is create a hardware Center within Daedalus because right now we're building a ledger Center in a treasure Center but it'd be nice to take one step out and say okay any u2f a device you can plug that in and we can write something so you can do access control recovery password a repair count recovery and I'm spending password from that and of course once we have that all figured out we can import that experience into the mobile side as well so that's one thing we think will make it much much easier to use Daedalus securely and help out everybody now this won't replace the need for writing your wallet recovery phrase down and there should be a secure way of doing that you know probably what we'll do is include it like with the paper wallet generator you print out a piece of paper and it has the slots so you can write it down twice on it fold it and put it in a safe or something like that another option is if you have a PGP key that's stored securely take those key words and encrypt them and send them in an email to yourself so if your email gets compromised you have an encrypted backup no one's gonna break that if if along your PGP keys secure I and you know as long as you have access to that the email will store that I've been known to do that from time to time so there's a lot of ways to securely store a recovery phrase and Charles Morgan will do some content on that we've been trying to kick them into this but we've been so busy with the audits if you lose the Yubikey so in general nothing because in all three cases it's easier shielded so very difficult to extract or it requires the stuff that's sitting on your computer however it does create problems for you because if you lose that key then you're then you're gonna have to restore the wallet to be able to use it so you can either create a second key and store that in a safe or you can write your your wallet recovery phrase down and then just delete the wallet restore the wallet from the role of recovery phrase so if we do this then we should be able to create a lot of content show people how to use it securely yeah CIA is not just the whole thing so you see confidentiality integrity and availability there's also there's also Cena a confidentiality integrity non repudiation and authentication it's another way of looking at it as well and there's those the problem is that the more things that you do to make this is the more precise your right you tend to lose availability so it's becomes increasingly more difficult for mainstream users to use the system appropriately so we've seen major improvements in security usability trade-offs by using biometrics and cell phones with two-factor authentication like authy or Google Authenticator or Microsoft Authenticator but it's still we got a long way to go yeah what Leger Nando axe Tobin Daedalus well I've been looking into whether legio a ledger nano axe is a phyto compliant device so if it is then we conceivably could use the same approach that we use with the Yubikey for access control and I suspect it there's something that could be done there yes it Connor the answer to your question is yes card out is well more than secure enough with Prowse rather than Genesis one of the reasons why we chose that trade-off is that or horse is still not a completely finalized protocol it took an enormous amount of time to kind of come up with a reasonable variant of Cardinal that we felt could be brought to a mainstream product and that's Prowse what Genesis gives you is it gives you a little bit more like Bitcoin security principle but remember when we're starting the hybrid phase there's the or horse BFT cluster so you already have like a collection of trusted actors that are acting as training wheels as a network is launching what Prowse Genesis the big difference is you don't need a checkpoint to completely bootstrap from Genesis trust lessly you just need the original distribution so given that we already have that cradle mechanism it's like the Genesis doesn't really give you much security but moving forward Genesis definitely will especially as network gets older so we'd like to para not only Genesis but like the work we're doing with spikes to deal with spikes of dishonest majority which makes Genesis even more useful so what's happening is that all the research is converging Prowse will come out it's good enough to run the network indefinitely and it's not going to have any problems but then there's gonna be a second wave of things we do before the Year closes out to bundle in some other ideas perhaps some ideas from spikes Kronos and Genesis to finish off or Bors so so overall I you know it was just one of those how long is a piece of string things and Kraus is well moored enough to run the entire system and the difference between Prowse and Genesis is not significant the distance the difference between classic and Prowse is very significant they use different random number generation techniques they have adaptive security in one case whereas the other does not Kraus and Genesis is more of a chain selection role where there's a clever way of doing chain selection that gives you the ability to bootstrap from Genesis but in practice you can replicate this with a checkpoint and given that we're going to have that cradle mechanism right at launch in the hybrid mode it's effectively the same thing so you're not really losing anything there and our goal was to get Shelley to market as quickly as possible so we didn't think it was prudent to wait another 2 or 4 weeks to get Genesis rule and given that we're gonna change the protocol again in three to six months how have the audits been going the audits are done then a foundation is negotiating the next wave of audits but the route and I'm beyond it's done and we cleared it and that's in the forum and read it if you guys want to see it planning for the sumit mic is going quite well we're having a great time with that you know we're gonna make a lot of announcements at the end of the month about the date you had these things we have the software selected and we have five or six work streams special guests invited and everybody's writing their presentations and content it's it's caught along pretty well oh good I don't know Fuji u2f is supported and fidos yeah so now that was my suspicion as well about the legend nano acts it's a programmable device I'm Kaylen long launching her crypto bank she's been working on that for a long time and I've been checking in every few months and say hey how's that going I'm real proud of the work she's done and her founders have done they really roll the boulder uphill they had to change the laws and a state deal with the Federal Reserve there was court cases it was one of those stories you got to read a book about one of these days and when and there will be a book written about it I think Kalin's one of the best female entrepreneurs in our space you know probably one of the best entrepreneurs in our space period all people included she's an inspiration and she's a tough tough woman really tough grew up during the wallstreet era and had to deal with a very very male-dominated wall street in the 90s and and so forth and that was not exactly the friendliest place to be a woman it was it was a special culture like a wolf of Wall Street type of culture but despite that managed to overcome all of that and succeed have a phenomenal career become a great leader and launch one of the most innovative banks in all of banking across the entire world and do so in a way that the government is forced to accept it despite the fact that they don't like it and it creates a big opening for us as an industry and potentially could solve a lot of custody issues that were running into for a variety of assets so she's one of the best and were a better space because she's here and it's just a better industry because of the tireless work that that they've been doing in Wyoming and I have an enormous amount of respect for her I will confer not Jack Dorsey or Steve Wozniak yet the virtual cement in fact I think the person who's coming is far more meaningful and his work has been far more impactful on us all than either of them and that's not to say that Jack and Steve didn't do impactful things I mean Twitter Twitter and Apple are pretty good companies but this particular person did more and that and those kind of and and and this work has been much more meaningful but won't tell you who it is do you have any inkling that Adam back is Satoshi of all the Satoshi candidates Adam back is actually the one who fits the profile as I've repeatedly said somebody educated the British education system he meets the educational band the programming experience band the culture and personality it kind of talks like him the grammar is about the same and it's probably not a coincidence that he would be working at a company like block stream I would be not shocked if Adam back was Satoshi Nakamoto I would not be shocked at all in fact I'd say he was very likely candidate for that to be the case you know but again it's it's not particularly important who's Satoshi and Adam himself has repeatedly said that what does I oh geez relationship with IBM we have great relationship we collaborate with IBM Research on the horizons 2020 privilege grant that we got for software update and we all the time talked to their group and we are joining the hyper ledger group and we'll pull some of our product lines into hyper ledger so we we talked to them through that organization as well it's Steve Jobs back from the dead at the virtual summit you know I never got to meet Steve Jobs I've met everybody healing must gone down and I never got to meet Steve and I always was sad about that some people they just go before their time and the world would be a better place at Steve live just a few more years to to take the next wave of innovation for Apple it's real sad that he went that said you know things move on and you just have to find ways to get things where they need to go without them one coinbase anything I can't tell you that any thoughts on staking coin being considered securities by the SEC I don't believe so they're clearly not I mean you have a virtual resource and that virtual resource entitles you to do something but you have to do that thing to profit and that thing provides material value and benefit to the entire network you can't say the fact that this is the only way that people can spend their money is by you doing your job that your job is not meaningful and necessary and you don't get paid if you don't do the job that is not a bond that is not interest and you're not entitled to any payment your performance is what results in payment so that certainly doesn't make it as security in the fact that the asset also has meaningful real utility from the gas model which the SEC seems to think does for a theorems case certainly provide real non security value I just can't see proof of State natively making something as security but you know there's a facts and circumstances of course that exists and these are on a case-by-case basis with each ecosystem Sheryl's any update on the card on a Wikipedia I know some people in the community been working on it and they've been trying their best the editors have still been exceedingly difficult I mean they're saying things like Bloomberg is not a legitimate source and Forbes is not a legitimate source I mean it's Danny R comical at this point the things that have Wikipedia just to give you an example okay just an example I bought legends of valor it's a video game I bought it for modest sum of money it has a Wikipedia page okay a video game from 1992 that I'm willing to wager at any given time less than five people in the world are playing and probably less than a hundred thousand people even know about okay has a Wikipedia page but Cardno a project that's worth 1.3 billion dollars hundreds of thousands of people are using know about are engaged in millions of dollars of transactions every day 60 plus research papers behind huge company behind that operates in more than 40 countries that is not novel enough to have a page now legends well are has a a page the guy who owns legends of mälar is not novel enough to have a page they're fighting to take a town in fact in fact they the editors at Wikipedia were even trying to say I wasn't an etherium founder that there wasn't credible evidence that it was in the theory and founder because they understood that if I was in a theory of founder I would be sufficiently novel to have a page so they were trying to get rid of that this is what we're dealing with with Wikipedia it's it's it's great it's just great it's just like it's like Kafka designed a website and and this and they said go have fun with it it's some it's just a basket of Horrors there has to be something better there absolutely has to be something better and I'm just I'm just having fun listening to it I like every now and then the editors we were trying to create content for the community are messaging me and saying like this stuff is unbelievable and I was like yeah you're right it's an exercise in patience why isn't card on oh I which came part of the w3c consortium yet I which key is going to join the w3c we were waiting until we came a full US company and we are now in IO G will join w3c in 2021 we're also joining hyper ledger we recommended that the Cardinal foundation join as well and that we can make meaningful contributions the web payments and the interoperability committee the inter ledger committee but I believe very firmly that the w3c is a good vehicle it's not perfect but it certainly is very effective and low-cost vehicle for Standardization so we're definitely joining that hey Charles are you a Formula one fan and not so much I really admire the engineering and the people who do that stuff and I've taken the Lamborghini out on tracks I got it up to 184 miles an hour it was a lot of fun probably too fast but but I haven't really gotten to car racing unless I'm doing it myself I have a friend who has a McLaren and we go at it I think that's like 300 kilometers an hour for those of you in metric Land any collaborations with stellar no but I do have a lot of respect from people at the cellar team Jed's good guy and David Missouri's real smart guide - there's some good people over there we occasionally run into them in Africa they did the Kafar Eeyore khofifah coffee project in Ethiopia and a few other things there's actually a lot of really good people in this face you know there's so much passion and drama and maximalism and this is a scam and that is a scam but you know if you actually sit down with these people have dinner with them lunch with them drink with them you have a lot of fun you know it's a good conversation usually and we're all basically the same into motorcycles I used to be ida Ducati SR - monster I'd love that thing I wrecked it four times cool Fifi yeah there we go is cardinal hydra gonna have routing problems like the Lightning Network you know there's a lot of great research on routing and this is one of the reasons why it takes a little bit of time to roll these things out there is a natural routing candidate set that has bonding behind it and it's explicitly known by the network because of the delegator x' and stake poles and so forth and so it's actually a lot easier to solve the routing problem particular with with Hydra then it would be in vanilla lightning on top of Bitcoin as the Bitcoin kind of works against you whereas Cardno and/or Boris kind of works with you in that respect so it's actually quite big quite easy to work with that Charles any is Michael Peyton Jones still working with you yes yeah Plutus is going along pretty fine we'll have a big update on Plutus at the summit virtual summit just switch from a molten tar monster number three video to this video when MMA fight I'm first you have my my sincere sympathies I'm very sad that you got the brain damage from going into that world I'll give you a little bit of time to recover you know from from what's happened there there will be no MMA fight I could not care less about intent MTM number three he's a nobody he had his one shot to be somebody and actually have something and he blew it he's not in a position to make any demands of us any more so than the crazy homeless guy masturbating in the streets probably end up that way I and that's all that needs to be said about that are you the real Justin Sun hit Justin Sun actually like him you know it I don't take a position on Tron or nod outside of the fact that when they forked the theorems code they should have used mantis it was boneheaded to go with the Java client but neither here nor there but Justin's been nothing but nice and pleasant to me every time I'm I've met him and he's never said anything negative about us and his community for the most parts very positive and pleasant when they talk about us they don't come in to our forums she opposed us and say we're horrible human beings you're scammers they just kind of do their own thing I so you know it Tron is a project like any other and it's following a very Chinese model of innovation of of accusation go acquire things until you have innovation if it works it works if it doesn't work okay I mean people buying in that ecosystem live within that ecosystem and Justin wakes up every day I talk in his book and pushing his thing and he does attempt from time to time to collaborate and if the space was like that it would be a lot more pleasant what I disliked in the space is that people seem to think that if they disagree they have to be disagreeable as a huge problem huge problem is it's so counterproductive guys it's okay to think that my ideas are bad our protocols aren't going to work and that Cardno is not going to be a successful product that's fine okay vote with your wallet with your feet but with your internet time go somewhere else well what's not okay is to say that because of these things everybody who's connected to Cardno is a dishonest evil person and we're all horrible human beings and we're out to steal money from Grandma just because you don't think something's going to work doesn't necessarily mean that the people on the other side of it are bad evil people I remember working on the Ron Paul campaign we had very strong obvious disagreements with the Democrats because we were on the Republican side right and I remember being in Iowa I and the people working on the Obama campaign in the Clinton campaign we're doing the Grassley going all 99 counties they were just as tired just as worn down as the people around the Republican side now obviously very strong political differences here and we thought that they were going to take America down the road to hell but at the end of the day we were both in the same position tired worn down and like operating on nothing in the gas tank because we were fighting for our respective beliefs and a lot of the cases you could go have coffee with them and because you had common experiences and you're in common industry that's the way the world should work disagree without being disagreeable the people who don't believe in the things you believe in have different values than you that doesn't mean they're evil and it doesn't mean they're here to screw you you judge people objectively if you think something's a scam then that's a very high bar okay just because a business fails or an idea doesn't work doesn't make it a scam it's only a scam if there's intent and it's clear that people in the project know that it's not going to work and if you see people saying things that they know are lies and you can prove that you know Kay that's a scam that but this is why I spoke out against big connect and one coin in these things because it was obvious you could look at the economics the structure how they were selling and how they were presenting it and how they would respond to criticism but at the same time I I have huge huge grievances with EOS and cerium and Bitcoin and I've called them out when I say they're saying things I don't think are honest but I never once say that dan Larimer is a criminal he's not we have strong disagreements about the way we think things ought to be and we leave it at that strong disagreements and the communities will decide and we'll see which one ends up right but I don't for once believe that damn is sitting there singing to himself boy I'm so glad I defraud it all these people he didn't you know he doesn't think this way he honestly in his mind believes that what he's doing is right and the project he's building is going to be successful or at least has a better shot at being successful than my project comes at Alec's project can the rest of the gang and that's okay and every now and then we can collaborate and work together and talk to each other and learn from each other and every now and then we have to kick each other in the face competitively it's a way that world works but we don't have to be disagreeable about it for the most part we haven't been with notable exceptions and yes Epstein didn't kill himself norm Cardno in 2030 a theory morale grant I believe neither if we're still around in 2030 which I believe me will be that it'll be the digital dollar from the US Federal Reserve and we're going to win that one hello from from sunny Arvada Colorado it was a very warm and beautiful day good day for a drive Arvada Colorado they had the avada Art Center there I used to take pottery classes when I was a kid oh this is a good question right here from Jimmy Anderson how do you prevent the ledger from becoming too large with 1000 transactions per second well will it be many terabytes of data in the future inevitably you will converge to a situation where the blockchain basically becomes too large to be a replicated artifact this is one of the fundamental failings of Bitcoin and one of the reasons why Bitcoin core is trying to keep the block size as small as possible because they understand that if the block size gets too large too much goes on chain you lose a property called inclusive accountability so inclusive accountability is this idea that everybody has the capability at least in principle of checking each other's homework so you can look at the blockchain I can look at the blockchain we can go through the whole thing and I can verify the same level of veracity and truthfulness as you can if you get to a situation that only one actor can have that entire history then you start losing that property that inclusive accountability you no longer have the ability for everybody chose homework now there are things you can do to get around this and you have to do all of the above so three things one you want to treat the resources of the blockchain as a precious commodity that's what block stream is doing but I think they've gone too far I think the calling cars is hurting their ecosystem by restricting their block size it should grow and it should grow at a reasonable rate and they're like real life metrics that are kind of like the Moore's Law equivalent of Network capacity and storage and I even told that in fact this nobody listens to me that you could I think use to create a model to allow the block size to gradually grow over time just like we have other metrics like the Bitcoin hang for example another bad design you never want to build a system where you have a dramatic event that makes everybody lose half their money for profit you know it's like why would you design a system that have sudden drops you should have a continuous curve instead of a discrete step function but anyway getting back to it one you treated like precious resource so how we do that as saying though the base ledger has a lot of capabilities but then take a lot of the stuff that is lower economic priority like micro transactions or high-frequency stuff and push those things into lit level to solution I think there's wisdom there as long as the level to solution is censorship resistant has the same privacy guarantees and is also open participation so Hydra mostly accomplishes this in its design okay - you need to use fundamentally different cryptographic primitives to secure your system in particular the concept of a snark recursive snarks are great for this where instead of saying show me everything you say show me a proof of what you've done is legitimate and all I need is to check what you've done against the proof and if I have just a little bit of information I know it's great so the project that's pushing this the heaviest is called the coda protocol co da and there they are trying to implement halo but Z cash has come up with some ideas and we're actually working on these ideas at i/o research and where it's is beginning days so it's not like we have a final solution yet but it's a super important thing now the advantage here is that these proofs are independent of the size of the shared state so you could have a massive UT EXO you could have a massive blockchain and you still be able to use the system with these proofs that are very small like megabytes two kilobytes I in practice and with the same level security as if you had a petabyte of data so that's absolutely amazing 3 you have to move from a replicated system to a distributed system - or to a decentralized system you have to distribute chunks of the chain to many different people and you have a shard of the data as opposed to the whole thing and you can always reconstruct with high availability guarantees anything you want on demand you have to do all three of these things and if you do all three of these things your system will be pretty good you probably should also implement some notion of economic garbage collection it's super controversial topic but it's something that needs to be done so you prune transactions out or you prune dead currencies out or things like that but you have to be careful about how you do that it's why we didn't for this five-year contract decided to do that we wanted to have a community for the next five years to have that discussion with to figure out the optimal solution and try to make it an industry-wide solution but if you can do those three things then you'll have a sustainable system because you can grow to any size and anybody can use it and have inclusive accountability you could wrote a nice eyes and any piece of history you're interested in will be available on demand and there's some economics behind that to make that possible and you can wrote any size but your growth rate is not stupid because you're emptying garbage and you're also not putting a bloat on the chain you're putting economically essential things on the main system so that's what you have to do if it gets the petabytes size it's not simple no protocol does this none zero zilch it's a super hard problem and it's a multidisciplinary problem you have to have miracles and data structures and miracles and distributed systems theory and cryptography miracles and a lot of network work because you're talking about a network that's gonna be moving a lot of data so it's it's a hugely hugely ambitious context the kind of thing I would love to solve over the next five years and we would have a gargantuan competitive advantage over everybody else and that's what would get us to a billion users or at least give us the ability to service a billion users thanks for the answer number 2d still me number three yeah you do because just because you can verify that what you're seeing is right because you're talking about an enhanced transaction which may have smart contracts and an embedded legal DSL and metadata and on other things you'll know that two properties are preserved one property of existence so the existence of the token so the asset you're looking at does exist and to that it hasn't been double spent the non-existence of a double spend you can prove those two things with a zero knowledge proof but it doesn't show you the history which may be relevant for an out-of-band regulatory scheme or things like that or compliance requirements that's especially true with security tokens so you need the ability to recall information on demand so that high availability is is required and also it's just a philosophical thing it's like you're gonna throw history away but you know this is economic data it's very important to preserve it that's what's Satoshi was right about that why was yellow shelved there were three requirements for that high-risk high-return project one was a demonstration that semantics based compilation was fully automated two was a demonstration that Kay had reached a certain level of maturity that it would be usable as a mainstream product and then three that performance of the machine generated back end would be reasonable not a hundred times or a thousand times slower than a handwritten implementation perhaps with an order of magnitude of that an enormous progress was made for SBC enormous progress was made in the rewriting of the Kay backend and Haskell an enormous progress was made with speeding up and optimizing machine generated code but we didn't hit all three targets and then we had to cut the budget somewhere because we went from dollar twenty eight and a much more vicious roadmap coming out of my own pocket to getting back to the original intent of the contract and so we decided that it would make sense to temporarily retire Kay in its introduction into the cardinal ecosystem into a later date see the thing is @rv yella grigory these things are independent of us and whether I say it or not grigory is gonna still write papers about Kay he's gonna still work on Kay he's gonna still optimize things and he has considerable resources to do that graduate students postdocs commercial contracts with companies like Boeing and so forth so there's funding there to keep doing his research and whether we pay for it or not he's going to do some of that research himself to localize that poll yella into Cardno of course that is something we'd have to work with him on now that a Treasuries coming again this is becoming another priority and I would love to see completion of the chimeric ledger design and a reintroduction of yella yeah into the roadmap post-2020 III very firmly believe that SBC and K is a fundamentally amazing thing for computer science and for just maintenance of these systems I mean literally all you'd have to do to give somebody access to your new programming language for smart contracts would be write the case semantics submit them to the blockchain and then suddenly it can auto build all your tooling your compiler and these things and if we ever updated yellow from yellow version 1 to 2 you don't have to rewrite your compilers to do that it's just not the case with Java land and dotnet land and so forth so there's real good reason why this guy at a top computer science school spent 15 years of his life figuring this stuff out and created things like reach ability logic for it it was it was fundamentally good science is just that we set objective milestones and we didn't achieve those milestones within the window that we needed to achieve them and it was certainly true that if funding was unlimited resources were unlimited I would have definitely renewed it and pulled it in it's faster but because those resources were in limited we couldn't do that another was the rena research if we had an additional five to ten million dollars we could have pushed far deeper into rena world than we did with our network protocol and and do things so so you know this is just the reality of running these things you have high aspirations and then reality kicks in and you have to make difficult choices about what to really focus on in the roadmap and where you can cut it responsibly the iPhone was no different you know they launched it without an app store or 3G and they reintroduced these things when they could but they were certainly on the original road map of the iPhone you just couldn't get to it to get that product launched in 2007 no I am NOT a Muslim worship Odin [Music] yeah it's definitely true about so many factors playing in it I mean this says this is the tough stuff about these things it's like it's always good to have these but god it's so complicated and you know there is very strong philosophy in computer science especially in the programming language world there's the imperative guys and object-oriented guys and you got the functional guys and that's like oil and oil and water they don't mix very well and they just look at the world really differently and it was really difficult to try to merge those two together in a harmonious way and I and I give Manuel Chekov Rd and Gregori both a lot of kudos for having saintly patients to manage their respective teams and do that but but unfortunately you know you have to pick and choose your battles and the DSL driven approaching and the Plutus driven approach is incredibly powerful and it's something wholly unique to cardenal and frankly it's probably how smart contracts should be done on Bitcoin had Satoshi been a PL expert then I frankly feel that that would have already been done that would have been the approach we have had that capability but he obviously wouldn't and so we didn't but I mean Plutus is great what are your thoughts about neural link I think it's probably one of the greatest inventions in human history if you think about information if you think about information you know the problem that we're constrained with is that evolution has only given us a very limited medium for input we have our eyes or ears you speak you know we can touch and these are fundamentally low bandwidth channels imagine having the world's best graphics card but then using that in a very old port like for example you plug it into like a USB port or something like that a USB 2 port or something no matter how powerful that card is locally because the communication channel between the card and the computer is so slow you are bound to that medium so we think in language we think in pictures we think in audio and these are all low-bandwidth in a certain respect and we haven't invented languages that are higher bandwidth there's been some attempts to do that now and like the sapir-whorf hypothesis talks about this but anyway neural link is saying we're going to now drill a hole into your head we're gonna put wires into your brain somehow make that work and not kill you or make you crazy and then suddenly you can now utilize a high bandwidth channel that is potentially three to five orders of magnitude higher than the channel that you use for speech for for hearing touch these types of things and the power of this is that if it works it means you can take a very complex concept like I don't know Weinstein's theory of everything or the I'm Stein's general theory of relativity or something you to super complex concept that would take months of difficult study to understand the basic concepts of and then package that in a new way and transmit it to somebody and have them get it in a way that's a thousand times ten thousand times a hundred thousand times faster that's the hypothesis of neural link at its core everything else aside now this is generation 10 generation 20 of the technology but if you look at the evolution like cell phones you get a new generation every 18 to 24 months so generation 10 is 240 months that could be 20 years from now and there's already a population or you get to play with that everybody's okay with that there are millions of people in the world there are quadriplegics paraplegic severe epileptics neural problems with their hands other things that these devices will be able to be a therapeutic intervention just like deep brain stimulation is for people with Parkinson's and so forth and it's a therapeutic intervention that's significantly better than the incumbent technology so there's a very strong biomedical incentive for implanting this in a cohort that will give you all of the data that you need to get to generation two and in generation three and eventually if they'll be Generation X which goes from medical to recreational recreational means you go from thousands and tens of thousands high expense to millions low expense and they're implanted okay if you do that uh-huh that's a game-changer because they can be easily inserted easily removed and every 24 months people will start upgrading these links just like they do their cell phones and it's inevitable at that point for these high bandwidth information channels to work and you say well what can I do with it access control passwords identity management you can basically telepathy you can think and then communicate to other people like that and it's trans language so you can train you can do empathy sent emotions to people there's really no limit you can control a computer with your mind so you could think to type so you're thinking and words appear on your word document it's it's pretty insane you can control lights in your smart home so you just you can open your door like you have almost telekinesis in this respect it's it's it's it's really crazy what neural link has the potential to do what makes me most excited about neural link is how quickly they've been able to iterate through technology how many chips they've done over 12 chip designs and 36 months being in the hardware business ourselves it's like we fully appreciate that that is a very very exceptional thing and they have a very good team at that company so it's one of those technologies that that I've been watching with an incredible amount of anticipation I will not be a first generation tester but none of you will be because it's a medical device in the first generation but certainly over time that device will be important to bring in now that said there are substantial security concerns there are substantial concerns about privacy this is not a technology that society is prepared for much like when CRISPR came out it created a revolution in bio engineering and people are saying we'll wait in twenty or thirty years this technology could be used to make bio weapons in a small lab at a very low cost with people who have moderate skillsets instead of a giant government lab super high skill sets very expensive okay so barriers to entry go down cost goes down and what does that functionally mean it means that you can do really horrible things on the asymmetrical side so super careful about this technology and there's a big wisdom gap with it so we must approach it cautiously have you ever played Guild Wars I did it was actually I think the first free MMORPG say a very good game and a virus world what is the best profession to have futurist tell everybody it's all gonna get better by the way I haven't broken my my sobriety it's a dry year I do a dry year in a wet year this is Virgil's handcrafted vanilla cream it's a cream soda it's just sugar terrible for you terrible for you but not alcoholic which Starcraft racist Charles you even have to ask that come on Protoss we live friar described well if it's any consolation the wings of Liberty campaign of starcraft2 was better than the other two campaigns heart of the swarm and shadows of the void were just terrible and in that order increasingly terribleness they just did not end that game well and they completely screwed up the Xel'Naga so I'll give you that and yeah serger great but let's be honest here the dirt were just a crude copy of the tyranids from Warhammer come on it's true and the Terran heads were far far better executed than the Zerg were executed well you still do a maze after you launch le yeah we'll have more to talk about what does a big project besides cardio you are working on wouldn't you like to know did you ever play EverQuest or EverQuest - i did play EverQuest years and years and years ago in fact the creator of EverQuest unfortunately died it's really sad um you know gaming doesn't get enough credit yeah we tend to have this stereotype in society where games are just for fat nerds to sit around and just do stuff but let's really think about this there's just two dimensions of gaming I think are incredibly undervalued one dimension is that games are the last storytelling medium where you really truly get everybody's attention I was at the movie theater before this quarantine happened watching a movie and I had a girl to the left to me and another teenager to the right of me I was at the movies alone and both of them while watching were looking at their phones texting people while the movie was going on I'm just like what why are you even here like where I'm here in the movies to watch a movie to see a story why are you here why you're hot you're half distracted you're like snap chatting with somebody while watching the movie and the same is true television the same screws radio all of these different mediums even in conversations when you're talking to people the other person is just like Homer Simpson's brain da da da da da it's just just doing stuff right it's not real very few people are fully engaged but then when you look at games this is one of those examples where people get lost in them so much though that they can spend countless hours enthralled connected deeply they're in the moment so it's the last storytelling medium that we have where you have the undivided attention of your audience and that is so undervalued and there are great examples of where this is so powerful like the God of War franchise for example they're you know you're following Kratos going from just us really angry Spartan dude who was going on a crazy revenge trip all the way to an old man who is looking for redemption because he did legitimately really fucked-up horrible things and you feel for him and you just want it to work out and you know it's not going to work out and then he's got this kid and you're just like oh god how is this gonna happen and you're just emotionally connected to this character and you and you know just like they're you're in the driver's seat living this experience feeling this experience with Kratos and you have these great scenes like when Baer McCready did echos of an old life that soundtrack when Kratos is taking the the old blades that he had when he was killing gods and Greece and he has to grab these things because so that he can go to hell and use them it's just like wow it's like he threw his whole past away and now he has to go right back to where he started this something you'd expect to see and really high-quality cinema really high-quality stories great books that kind of come back again and again and you're seeing it in a videogame and everything the lighting the sound the experience is lined up perfectly and that's 2018 like where the is that medium gonna go up by 2030 so it's the best storytelling medium and is just getting good because of VR cuz graphics look at the Unreal 5 engine you tell me that that's not going to be fun to play with the other dimension is that we have all these sports like football and in baseball and basketball and various things that people can play competitively and it's the most part most people don't engage in that on a daily basis you do when you're young you play hockey and these things or whatever and then when you get older you kind of get out of it when you watch it on television so it's a passive action you look at competitive eSports everybody can play dota they can play League of Legends they can play overwatch they can play multiplayer games and engage with other people and socialize with other people and even though they can't play at the high competitive level they still can play the exact same game that the other people are playing and potentially with millions of people all across the world and gain new experiences this is unique to gaming and there's just nothing else in society that exists that has those two things that that deep intensive narrative connection and then that ability to play with people all over the world various ages and skill sets and every now and then you actually interact with people Bill Gates for example is an avid Xbox player so if you're playing xbox live game there is a potential that the person on the other side is Bill Gates the same for many politicians the same for many captains of industry Elon Musk for example is known to play Fallout and other games and some competitive games online so there's a potential very small of hermo that on the other side of the television you're actually playing against Elon Musk think about that so I do love games from that perspective but I think they got a bad rap because they were just tragically misunderstood now I'm going to two hours so let's get a good question in come on give me something good guys what do you do the dry year wet year thing if you're a CEO and you travel all around the world and especially in this industry there is a huge incentive to drink socially and otherwise so you do the dry year wet year thing just to remind yourself not to descend into alcoholism and it's it's big big big dividends I already talked about Dan Larimer sorry Steve said nice things about him any move towards privacy legacy addresses no not in this iteration but we are looking at vanity addresses because you can control the prefix in the back thirty-two standard and be super cool for asset issuers to have their own addresses for their assets and for people to use different asset different prefixes for different things like C mean for card auto maintenance C test for that so we are starting some discussions about what flexibility we have with that standard for prefixing are you planning on occurring at a centralized exchange mayhaps i'd have to say between the meditation and the dry year you seem to be the paragon of moderation and stoicism I assure you I have my vices that said I have been trying to gradually add more suffering into my existence recently I've started using a Schottky mat it's also known as a bed of nails I'm using the plastic one right now but it all upgrade to an actual bed of nails at some point the future and I'm slowly getting back into cold therapy I was doing cried yet I was doing the the liquid nitrogen bath where you go and stand naked in the liquid nitrogen chamber for a few minutes and freeze yourself it was like negative 200 degrees or something I was getting good at that but then the quarantine shut the place down so I have to get some other supplier and wim HOF method is certainly interesting so I'll get back into that there's this you can always find more ways of torturing yourself and I seem to be pretty good at that I do enjoy it must be a closet masochist what do you think about AMD competition right now I'm not exactly sure the question is that just a general competitive nature between the two companies or is there a particular competition that they're doing if you're talking about just a general competitive nature between the companies in terms of their projects I think that Andy made some incredibly clever bets on manufacturing in architecture and those bets are playing huge huge dividends for them lisa is is a great CEO she's done a phenomenal job at AMD attracting good talent making good strategic bets and really unifying their product lines in a way that it's meaningful for that company and the very fact that Rison is where it's at and now it's the best laptop processor around is is pretty cool and that's a testimony to how far they've been able to go since prior leadership so a big fan of that but you know Intel is an incredibly strong company they're led by brilliant people they have good management processes like okay ours so you can't count a company like that out they can get back in the game very quickly and they have before the last time we saw him D on top this aggressively was during the old days if you remember the AMD FX series the FX 51 and 53 and they were just kicking and telling the teeth until until double down on the Centrino line and brought out the core until core duo by the time Core 2 Duo and the i7 came out it was over Charles I'm a programmer I'd like to start to learn program with Cardno how do I start we'll have a lot for you at the virtual summit in the meantime I'd recommend downloading the Haskell book and starting there it's a good way to familiarize yourself with the paradigm of which people will be writing code in our space and that's a batteries included experience his McAfee privacy pause ghost coin you know John McAfee has a good way of ending it he's one of the most curious people in the cryptocurrency space he's charismatic as hell and incredibly fun to interact with talk to watch and it's just a shenanigans guy wherever mcafee go shenanigans follow you know it's like just it's like a drama factory and he's almost like the Willy Wonka you know he's just like what is he gonna make next what craziness is gonna come out of mcafee brain and McAfee says stuff I know who Satoshi is or I know this or I'm gonna do this or I'll eat my dick and he runs for president he just does stuff and no matter what he's gonna do stuff and I enjoy it I really do I think is it's a lot of fun in the industry where you have to be very careful about this is that there are high standards and bars to certain claims so it's one thing to run for president it's one thing just stay stay stuff it's one thing to claim you know Satoshi or whatever okay it doesn't really impact your life no it's another thing to say I've built something that's private okay if you claim that that's fine but we have very specific standards about that and those standards anybody can try to achieve it's not it's not like an ivory tower or something like that the Monaro guys get to play just as much as the sea cash guys and they follow different approaches and they're both making meaningful progress there okay however there are really strong definitions about link ability and your ability to do naanum eyes and and just basically how you build your anonymity said and the assumptions about how these cryptographic primitives work whether it be a ring signature as urology proof or whatever they have to be very very very careful about and even small flaws in the way that you do things can undo the entire system and in some cases in the worst of possible ways where not only doesn't undo the system it actually gives you less privacy than Bitcoin can okay so you have to be super careful about this I in the thing that I disagree with McAfee the most about is that he tends to do things in a way that doesn't follow Orthodox words productive for everybody like we have trip cost principle which says the security of a crypto system should only rely upon the secrecy of the keys you don't office Kate the protocols in the system it's just a bad idea you don't get anything from hiding the crypto system you're using so when you say things like proprietary cipher a proprietary crypto or we can't trust the NIST suite or something like that that's this hogwash you of course you can trust in a sweetie first it wasn't even built by the US government was built by independent cryptographers we're looking for fame and glory being able to tell their friends that they got to figure out the crypto that the NSA will end up using okay so you can trust these protocols there in the open domain they're peer-reviewed and people literally build careers by finding ways to break them or cause problems for them huge huge brownie points believe me whenever there's a problem with Intel SGX every time I go to CCS or your crypto crypto there's somebody with a paper telling the world about that problem okay you can't hide a secret in this space so anybody who endorses proprietary protocols or opaque protocols or in-house protocols get a little concerned about if the process is not right second if you claim you have a privacy coin the privacy coin has to be built with very specific definitions and very specific standards that have to be able to stand in the scrutiny amongst the community of people who worry about privacy for a living and in general they're your allies if you engage them correctly not your enemies or competitors so I get a little concerned when I see McAfee make these claims like I'm gonna build this new thing whether it be a hardware device or it be a new cryptocurrency and then I don't see the next follow-on to that by the way I hold everybody to this standard not just him for example David CIAM David is a legend he's a brilliant cryptographer in his work is one of the founding fathers of work for big blockchain and Bitcoin invented digi cash for example so David's recently created a project I think it's called elixir and there's not a damn thing I can understand and I've told David to his face that I don't get what he's doing and I can't understand it and I think he needs to do a better job of explaining it and going through the proper peer-review process I also years ago had dinner with Silvio McCauley and I said by the way there was some things in el gran that need to be cleaned out he said yeah yeah we'll get around to it and to Silvio's credit he did and he published more papers and he hired great engineers and they've done some phenomenal work there too David's not so credit he has yet to fix all these holes that exist there or at least comprehension things that exist there so I applied the same standard to McAfee if he's throwing his hat in the ring that I apply the Silvio McCauley that I apply to David charm that I applied to Dan Larimer tough italic and the rest of the gangs so you know we wish him well and we hope that it turns out to be a something novel and meaningful and it's a great product for the space to study and understand but as a consumer of these products my warning to you is make sure that people are held to a very high standard because at the end of the day it's your privacy it's your identity at the end of the day it's your money and you need to do your own research and you need to think about these things ok so all that all that said it's been a fun ama thank you guys so much for attending I really appreciate it and you know next time we'll have more to say the Pioneer test that's been just exactly what I expected it to be it's going from revenant to to maybe something a little bit more graceful and next week hopefully will no longer be revenant